[Cynnabar] Proposal to amend Cynnabar's Financial policy

Sun Sep 21 19:48:47 UTC 2014

I approve of both Ermenrich and Finn's proposals.

~Birke

On Sun, Sep 21, 2014 at 10:06 AM, Matt Lagemann via Barony <
barony at cynnabar.org> wrote:

> Overall I like the changes. I agree that the people at the meeting should
> be able to approve minor budget items in one evening. In my four years of
> meetings, I cannot recall a single time a budget item of $50 or less was
> ever an issue.  I don't see how this could be easily abused since anyone
> the group trusts as Seneschal can decide that it needs three meetings or
> point out that this is another request.
>
> Personally, if I had any qualms with the proposal, I would say this:  I
> don't think it goes far enough.
>
> I would like to see this for any expenditure under $50 regardless if they
> are an officer.  The same restrictions would apply (must be occasional, is
> not guaranteed, etc.).  Rarely are small budget items brought up by non
> officers, but I think it is worth considering.  For instance choir and
> dance practice are not ran by officers.  What if they need supplies (choir
> more likely than dance)? Just a thought.
>
> One thing to stress:  This does not mean that you can see someting under
> $50, buy it, and then bring it to the Barony with a guarantee that you will
> be reimbursed.  At that point you would be purchasing something with a risk
> that it will not be approved.
>
> To Lady Bree's point:  My concern is that not every officer needs the
> money, but the exchequer will have to keep a seperate set of books to keep
> track of the $650 allocations.  It is not a bad way of doing it, but I
> think with our financial stability and overall good stewardship of the
> money, Finn's suggestion fits our needs better.
>
> Ermenrich
>
> On Sat, Sep 20, 2014 at 3:55 PM, Cynnabar Seneschal via Barony <
> barony at cynnabar.org> wrote:
>
>> My answers for Sir Gregoire’s questions:
>>
>>
>>
>> Final discussion or any adjustments to my proposed wording will be done
>> at the meetings.
>>
>> Is there a proposed number of times an item can be brought up after it is
>> shot down once? [Finn] – Is this really a concern? What’s to stop
>> someone doing the same thing now with the existing process? This is where a
>> good seneschal should step in (if this ever happens) and say this was
>> already decided upon by the group and move on.
>>
>> Is there a limit to the number of $50 requests that can be made per unit
>> time? [Finn] – No. And it was done on purpose. The key word is
>> ‘occasionally’. This is to get the point that it should not be a
>> common/frequent item, but at the same time we should allow proposals that
>> may happen quickly back to back due to the need/situation at the time.
>> Trying to timeframe this into specific unit/time blocks can create
>> rules-lawyering (opps, you have to wait another 2 weeks before you can ask
>> that!) or even hamper simple requests that are may be needed (Hey, can we
>> get $20 to help with fighter food at a demo next weekend?). On the other
>> hand someone making $50 requests every week should be questioned why and it
>> should be readily apparent that something is not right. Thus the group
>> still needs to approve.
>>
>> Is there a minimum number of people required to be present to pass the
>> request? [Finn] – Same was what is required for every group approval on
>> our current 3-meeting process.
>>
>> Does this still follow consensus, or is it an absolute vote? [Finn] –
>> Consensus, as normal.
>>
>> If there are more feedback or suggestions, please let me know!
>>
>> -Finn
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Barony [mailto:barony-bounces at cynnabar.org] *On Behalf Of *Greg
>> Less via Barony
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 19, 2014 6:40 PM
>> *To:* Cynnabar Seneschal
>> *Cc:* Barony of Cynnabar
>> *Subject:* Re: [Cynnabar] Proposal to amend Cynnabar's Financial policy
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Finn-
>>
>> Just as many non-Cynnabar people are on the email list as Facebook.
>>
>> A few questions that come immediately to mind:
>>
>> Is there a proposed number of times an item can be brought up after it is
>> shot down once?
>>
>> Is there a limit to the number of $50 requests that can be made per unit
>> time?
>>
>> Is there a minimum number of people required to be present to pass the
>> request?
>>
>> Does this still follow consensus, or is it an absolute vote?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Gregoire
>>
>> On Sep 19, 2014 6:32 PM, "Cynnabar Seneschal via Barony" <
>> barony at cynnabar.org> wrote:
>>
>> Greetings  one and all.
>>
>>
>> We had discussed earlier at a business meeting ways we can help speed up
>> approving some smaller expenditures by officers in carrying out the duties
>> of their office. Several ideas and ways to do this were brought forth.
>> However, it kind of went by the wayside for a bit. A couple of items came
>> up recently that has rekindled me thinking about this. Normally, I would
>> just bring this up at a meeting, but since the change I am going to propose
>> below will update our only “official” document (our Financial Policy), I
>> wanted to give the chance for the larger group to give some feedback on
>> this.
>>
>>
>> Please note: I am NOT putting this on Facebook. Many, many people that
>> are not Cynnabar are part of that group, so please keep this conversation
>> to the Cynnabar e-mail list or in person.
>>
>>
>>
>> In short, the below update to the Financial Policy is to speed up minor
>> purchases by officers. The reason for this is to remove some of the
>> bureaucracy and unnecessary burden for minor items. But to still have the
>> budget items proposed and allow the request to be reviewed and approved (or
>> denied) by the group. Many ways were discussed previously on how to limit
>> (via wording/restrictions) these requests so they don’t get abused. In the
>> end, keeping things simple and trusting both the officers in their role and
>> the group in general to know when things are being abused should help
>> curtail any issues. Thus my wording below of “occasionally request” is
>> there on purpose.
>>
>>
>>
>> The proposed addition to the Cynnabar Financial Policy:
>>
>> 2. ii. 3. Group officers may occasionally request minor expenditures (up
>> to $50 or so) for carrying out the duties of their office. These minor
>> budget line item requests can be requested by the officer at a business
>> meeting and then approved or denied by the participants at that same
>> meeting.
>>
>>
>>
>> Feel free to give feedback here or to me directly on adding this to our
>> Financial Policy. This will be brought up at a regular business meeting and
>> run through the normal 3 meeting discussion/approval process to make the
>> final decision.
>>
>>
>>
>> In service,
>>
>> -Finn, Seneschal.
>>
>>
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